Comments on: The 20 Second Rule

By: Kenneth Woods

Kenneth Woods — Wed, 10 Jun 2009 13:12:33 +0000

Hi everyone and thanks so much for the comments.

Interestingly, none of the other guys read this post until after the tour and I decided not to say anything, but as the week went on, we gravitated much more towards the 20 second rule, and the rehearsals got better and better. Paul- you are absolutely right that it is generally inappropriate for non principal players to ask questions of the conductor in rehearsal for many reasons- more often than not, the principal knows the answer and time can thus be saved. The exception is the Berlin Phil, where all players are expected and required to speak up in rehearsals or lose their jobs!

By: Paul H. Muller

Paul H. Muller — Thu, 04 Jun 2009 18:53:19 +0000

I play in a university orchestra and we have student conductors from time to time and it is always amazing that they will stop us playing and then not tell us why. It is a trial by fire, they are learning and we are all very sympathetic, but if you are just starting out as a conductor be sure you can explain – in less than 20 seconds – whaT you want changed or played differently. Also, repeat the starting measure at least twice, and loud enough so us old guys in the back row of the brass section can hear it.

The thing that I find distracting as a player is when some second clarinet player or third violin asks the conductor a question directly. The players should always consult with the principal first, and let him ask the conductor for clarification. This keeps the chatter to a minimum.

The chamber groups I have played with are much more informal. Anyone can ask a question or ask to go over a passage, but the director starts and stops the playing. This seems to work and I believe it is all done within 20 seconds.

By: Elaine Fine

Elaine Fine — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 16:48:48 +0000

I like the 20 second rule, and think it could apply well in chamber music. Actually, the best chamber music rehearsals I have had have involved 20 seconds of discussion as a maximum for a given situation, and perhaps 200 seconds of action to collectively reinforce those 20 seconds of discussion.

In chamber music “play it, don’t say it” tends to be extremely effective.

By: Michael Monroe

Michael Monroe — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 15:51:10 +0000

I’ve been trying to be more disciplined about how much I talk during students’ lessons; a 20-second rule might help, at least when we’re working through a piece. When I first started teaching, I tended to assume the students were paying for words, so the more I said, the better. I’ve slowly learned that, while there’s always something more to say, the student often does better when I’m mostly listening, especially because, as you said, one idea is likely to stick better than dozens.

I actually learned this some from my watching my daughter’s lessons with a very old-school Russian violin teacher. The teacher is not mean or intimidating, but she controls focus by speaking minimally and quietly, and by listening intently. I’m amazed at how she’ll patiently listen to my daughter painfully sightread her way all the way through a new etude. It’s probably true that the teacher’s below-average English contributes to her approach, but my daughter has done so much better than she did with a previous teacher who was always “on,” always joking, always coming up with clever analogies, always “teaching.” With the new teacher, the communication is often accomplished with simple redirections while playing, or with little gestural reminders about shoulder, arm, bow-hold, etc.

As for composerbastard’s comments, maybe we can all use Twitter as a model. The 140-character limit drives me crazy, and it’s not good for substantive, nuanced arguments, but I’m often amazed at how it helps me distill an idea. Ken, maybe you could start Twittering your rehearsal comments onto a big screen that the orchestra could see! (OK, that’s a bad idea, but I had an amazing class experience in which I had laryngitis, so I showed an opera DVD while typing running commentary off in a side window. It was quite successful, and allowed the music to be heard without my blabbering over the top.)

By: ComposerBastard

ComposerBastard — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 13:57:11 +0000

20 second rule as I understand it deals with “promotions”

There’s also the 20 minute rule which applies to “meetings” and also giving “speeches” in public.

Maybe composers should stick to 20 second rules in writing? Or maybe that should be a 4 minute rule….hmmm got me thinking.

Mapbe blog posts should be restricted to 20 seconds.

Maybe comments to blogs should be restricted to 20 seconds…If thats true I have overstayed my welcome